Bargmann ON
Dutch BANKING
6
On the record
What's NewS Nummer 4 August 1995
How is Rabobank perceived in the domestic market and by the local competi-
tion? Who better to ask for an objective view than the new deputy head of cor-
porate banking and recent recruit from that very competition, Robin Bargmann.
Robin Bargmann says he has spent his
whole career in the 'Dutch' banking indus-
try, hut in fact he also brings to the bank a
broad range of international experience
gained in New York and London. 'But
that is very different to what I call
"Dutch" banking,' he says. 'The Dutch
are very entrepreneurial and anything but
traditionalist. We're prepared to introducé
new ways of doing things so we don't al-
ways conform.' The reason, he believes, is
because the Dutch domestic market is so
small. Because economie growth is limit-
ed, Dutch companies and therefore Dutch
banks are obliged to cross borders to in-
crease their business. 'So, for competitive
reasons, the Dutch have had to grow
along with the international banking in-
dustry. I think Dutch banks have done
that pretty well. And our image abroad
reflects that international orientation.'
STRENGTHS AND WEAKNESSES
This brings us neatly to the subject of the
Rabobank's image in the domestic cor-
porate banking market. The results of a
Het kersverse plaatsvervangend hoofd
van bedrijfsrelaties Robin Bargmann,
geeft zijn kijk op de Rabobankorganisatie. Hij
concludeert: hoewel zijn vorige werkgever,
ABN, het imago van top-bedrijfsbank in de
markt heeft, heeft Rabobank de kwaliteiten in
huis om die positie te beconcurreren.'De grote
bedrijven wachten op ons,'stelt hij.'Wij moe
ten ze niet te lang laten wachten.'
recent survey were somewhat
disappointing. Bargmann's for-
mer employer, ABN Amro
scored higher than Rabobank
on many counts, even when it
comes to corporates' percep-
tion of the 'strongest bank
abroad', and this in spite of
Rabobank's Triple-A rating.
'Well,' says Bargmann, 'I think
3 ABN works pretty hard on its
image, also as the best product
innovator. But having seen
5 Rabobank from the inside, I'd
say that was a myth. I think
ij the quality is better here and
s people are certainly equally
ambitious. Maybe they are less
extrovert than ABN, which is far more
aggressive.' Having said that, Bargmann
also thinks Rabobank lacks a certain
strength in certain markets. 'We haven't
been a large player in equity markets,
especially on the origination side. We do
better on the Mergers Acquisition side.
But ABN Amro has always been strong in
the equity market, so maybe in that sense,
they seem more innovative.'
INTERNAL CONFLICTS
He still finds it hard to define Rabobank's
strengths because the organization is so
very diverse. 'Just take the domestic or
ganization,' he says. 'The member banks
have a level of independence, meaning
they are strong locally, but probably not
regionally, and I say that as someone who
spent a considerable time as head of one
of ABN's regional offices. That means
there are potential conflicts of interests
within the member-bank organization. For
example, Rabobank Rotterdam is interest-
ed in a cliënt based in Dordrecht, i.e. a
prospect for the local bank there. Neither
bank wants a conflict of interest, so, in the
end, neither touches the cliënt. I think that
explains why the bank has a fairly limited
presence in the middle market. lts strength
is definitely increasing at the upper end,
because that is being done from CBS. And
I also think that Dutch corporates are
kind of waiting for us to make an even
larger entry in that market. You can ac-
tually hear that.'
BEST CHOICE
Asked whether he means the grapevine, he"
says: 'No, I've actually had people say to
me: "We're waiting for you." That win-
dow of opportunity will be there for the
next two or three years. So 1 think Rabo
bank has to move, now. The competition
will also be moving. But there is a lot of
sympathy for Rabobank out there. It is
looked on as a careful, sensitive and low
risk-profile bank; and therefore, as an al-
ternative to ABN, we're probably the best
choice. Again, we have to be careful. ING
is very aggressive and they are using their
doublé presence in the corporate market
as both an institutional investor and credit
bank to very great effect. On the other
hand, they may be a bit too aggressive. I
know a number of corporates who don't
really appreciate a bank walking in and
stating they are co-owner of the company.j|
SELF-ANALYSIS
Bargmann is not sure we're moving fast
enough. 'It could always be faster. Our
people work pretty hard and, in my view,
we're understaffed. A company which did
an outside study of the bank confirms that
- we're understaffed in level and in num-
bers. But there is quality enough here, and
there's a lot of ambition. Probably, we
have to work on being a bit more aggres
sive, a bit more self-confident. You know,
everyone is talking about image, but es-
sentially the image we want comes with
success. What strikes me about the
organization as a whole is a kind of intro-
version. You talk about the image survey.
That is just one of 31 ongoing quality pro-
jects. Now, they are all very necessary. But
we should actually be translating what
we've learnt into practice. That's not easy
because for the past year everyone has
been discussing what's right or what's
wrong or what could be done better.
But this self-analysis won't make any
money.'
FUN AND ENVY
'I see my task here as bringing back that
entrepreneurial spirit. I'm trying to work
with the team leaders here as responsible
business people. I don't want anyone wait
ing around for instructions. We can agree
targets and the way we want to approach
the market, but essentially they should
treat me the way they treat their clients -
telling me what 1 need to know. It's much
more fun that way. You know, a lot of
banks are envious of Rabobank's CBS be
cause we have all our divisions here, undef
one roof, even the international division.
We've got it all, we just have to make sure
no one operates in isolation, because, as I
said, the market is out there waiting for
us.'